Hi, this is we sawn about. Yeah, the host of the shaping
freedom podcast. I'm thinking a littlewhile ago about this podcast and my intention
for it, and the intention is, quite frankly, to share the stories
of everyday people who are doing extraordinarythings, and those extraordinary things are sometimes
not about the huge accomplishments that peoplemake or have. It's more about how
people are being in the myth ofsome of the challenges that we encounter in
life, even while doing all ofthe beautiful, extraordinary things that human beings
have the capacity and ability to do. My guest today is just one of
those women. She is a anincredible lady who is an entrepreneur at of
Illinois. She is a former militaryperson who went ahead and got a degree
in business and years later, madethe decision to create a community for creative
people. Very similar act lead to, you know, the Hara hub concepts
and focus specifically on creatives, andthis business is called a cotton seed creative
exchange. Please check it out.She is, or this business is,
out of Illinois in Aurora, andthat is a fantastic thing that this woman
is up to. What she's alsoup to in her life is finding ways
to show up more powerfully, moreauthentically and with the generosity of spirit to
share her triumphs and what she's doneand is doing while navigating this journey of
life that we're all on. Hername is Van Michelle Thompson and I'm really
excited to share my conversation with her. Take a listen. So I'm really
excited to speak with this week's guest. My guest this week is Evan Michelle
HIV on. Hi Listening. Thankyou for having me. You're welcome.
You're welcome. And so this iskind of a funny interview in some ways,
or at least the road to thisinterview is, is pretty funny,
because has Ivan, you and Imet each other through social media. We
met it that each other through instagram. And one of the things that and
I think it was actually during thepandemic, during like the the doc days.
It was. It really was,yeah, during two thousand and twenty,
and so, you know, Iwas on Instagram, you know,
telling Miley sound story, and vanwas on instagram telling her Ivan Story,
and we really just started communicating witheach other through that, through that,
and then at that time and thenat some point I started to really follow
your story and your incredible energy andhow deep and positive you show up on,
you know, this thing that wecall social media, and you know,
I know that one of the thingsthat I can always count on is
a really solid word filled with wisdom, you know, when we encounter each
other on social media. And soI think it was a few weeks ago
maybe that I was like, youknow, a girl, come on my
show. I appreciate it absolutely.Yeah, I agree with social media.
It's just, you know, weall have this responsibility to like, you
know, put something positive out therewhenever we can and benefit the next person
who might see it. So Idefinitely have my days where they're not as
positive, but I always try topull some positivity out of there, you
know, encourage everyone. Were onthis journey together. So absolutely, and
life isn't always about you know that. You know, I think we all
want to be smiling all the time, but life doesn't always serve that up
and I think it's it's what Ireally respect and appreciate about what I've witnessed
through your you know, the lastcouple of years that we've been following each
other. Is that again? Likeit's not the gooey sweet hey everything's great.
It's you know, what can Iwhere's that little ray of sunshine that
I can find in a moment wherethings are shitty? You know? Yes,
yeah, for sure, that's reallywhat I saw. What I see.
Well, thank you. I definitelyappreciate that, because I feel that
in the morning I have two choicesto make. It's, you know,
if I'm not having a great day, if things are not going well,
I can choose to harp on thator I can choose to harp on the
opposite, which I think if youharp on the opposite of the negative feelings,
your day of go a lot smooth. There, you know, things
will just start falling back into place. You know good things will start happening,
because I feel like when you focuson the negativity throughout the day just
continues. It just continues, andit's proven that to me many instances.
I'll give you an example, likeyesterday, just woke up, felt completely
overwhelmed with everything and just didn't shakeit. Just just continued on that path.
Go to the bank, deposit somemoney. It didn't accept the money
because it was too much, sothat all the money just started flying back
out of the slot. So andit was just, you know, one
thing I just I just said,okay, I'm doing this to myself,
you know, like yeah, it'sjust that one thing, and I just
think sometimes at one thing. Maybeit's not like magic or anything like that,
but it's just when we're in thatnegative mind frame, we're not really
paying attention two things the way weshould, like, the way, you
know, we may do something thewrong way simply because our mind is just
not not not they're not feeling happy, not feeling, you know, the
way it should, you know.So that's that's kind of like, you
know, I'm a advocate for sayingthat. You know, it doesn't matter
how old we are, we arealways learning, always growing and and you
know, every single day, likeI think about myself two years ago and
you know, the where I amtoday, mental fully, completely different person.
And you know, and I thinkit's a choice. It's a choice
that we make. So, youknow, we're you know, life is
going to happen. As long aswe continue to breathe, you know,
things are going to continue. Wejust have these choices to make to grow
or to stay where we are.So I just I choose. I choose
to grow. So, yeah,I choose growth every day, and sometimes
the growth is like wonderful and myarms are open and I'm like yeah,
I love it, and other daysI'm like Shit, I know I have
to grow through this one, butit hurts, you know, or it's
hard or I don't know how toget to the other side of it.
I want to go back to youtalking about how you get up in the
morning, because I find too,that whatever those thoughts are first thing in
the morning, you have to Ihave for me. I have to tend
to that thought, and so ifit's a positive thought, that's something that
I know needs to be nurtured,and if it's a thought about something that
I have to deal with that maybefeels uncomfortable, I also know that that's
something that I have to deal withand take care of, and so I
really love the fact that you,you know, think about that in your
morning, because that really, likehow we get up, is what sets
the tone for the rest of theday, and it just has no law
and snowball, as you know,absolutely absolutely. And it's also creating somewhat
of a force field around yourself,because we encounter so many things that are
outside of our control, and alsoso many different energies that may not be
on the same frequency that we areon, and it's like, you know,
you have to just make a decisionbecause, you know, being a
human also means being very delicate.You know, one thing that I say
is humans are very delicate, andthat's that's kind of like, you know,
part of my mission that I focuson is just not really looking at
how people act or or what theydo as to more of maybe that person
just have has a different experience andthan I have or they've had a different
life, so that's why they actthe way they do, you know,
giving people a lot more grace.So what I find is that, you
know, I listened to a motivationalspeaker not too long that said, what
you listen to in the first twentyminutes of the day, since the tone
or whatever you whatever you see orwhatever you watch, literally sets the tone.
And I've tested this myself. IfI choose to get up in the
morning and listen to a motivational speechor td Jake's or or meditate or,
you know, try to write downthings that I'm grateful for, I find
that throughout the day, I meanI just find more things to be grateful
for. I find more, morejoy, you know, despite maybe something
happening, but I've already set myselfup for the day to not to receive
to receive joy. Yeah, absolutely, absolutely, and it's just like we
those we do have control over someaspects of that. It's just what we
allow, the energies we allow aroundus, the things that we want.
You know, social media can begood, but it can also be bad.
You know, we choose that rightbe until the end of the day.
People talk about like social media likeit's this horrible thing, and it's
horrible when you've allowed horrible to bearound you. You know, I always
say that. You know, ifyou would not allow someone who is just
always ranting and raving about the negativeinto your living room, why would you
allow it into why would you allowthat energy into your home or walking around
in your hand all day or sittingin your bed while you're checking social media?
You know, we think you havea responsibility to create the world that
we want to live in, andthat includes what we allow into our energy
field through things like social media.Absolutely, absolutely, like you said,
you know, you wouldn't let certaintypes of people into your living room or
into your physical space. Yeah,we should always take a look at the
hey, social media, you know, our personal pages are our space happen,
and we can, you know,we can curate it the way we
want. You know, we canhave, you know, we can have
people on there that inspire us orpeople that don't inspire us, or people
that perpetuate things that, you know, we don't agree with, or we
can have the opposite. So it'sit's a you know, like you said,
you know, we do have controlover a lot of these aspects.
So it's important that we realize thatwe do have a lot of power,
and that's what I'm growing into.Is My power. Is that I realize,
you know, I'm not a victim. I'm not a victim to my
childhood, I'm not a victim tomy trauma's, I'm not a victim to,
you know, someone cutting me offin traffic. My personal self,
my space, my spirit is,is my sanctuary. So I don't,
you know, I don't allow thingslike that to really affect me as much
anymore. Yeah, I love thatyou're saying that he bomb, because that
even that statement that I'm not avictim. There's a way of placing the
power of that outside of yourself andsaying, well, I'm a victim because,
boom, boom, boom, thesethings happened to me and therefore I'm
labeling myself victim. Or you cansay I'm a human being, a delicate
human being, who is showing upevery day and trying to make those first
twenty minutes of my bag a count, and I encounter things sometimes that are
not expected or that are negative orchallenging for me to get through. But
you're going to call yourself something differentthan if it absolutely you know, because
also really you create that like you'respeaking to your soul. Oh Yeah,
you you know, when you getup or when you will talk about social
media, like when you get onsocial media and you surround yourself energetically with
negative thoughts and negative people and negativeposts, you are speaking that into your
soul. You're telling your soul thatthat's the world that you want to live
in. Just like when you walkaround feeling or placing yourself in this position
of being a victim, you're statingthat, you're stating your victimhood, you
know, and how much more powerfulis it to state that you're a delicate
human going through life doing this?Say you know, absolutely, absolutely,
I definitely agree with that. Andalso just you know, in the past,
I would say like six months,I've just I used to have the
victim mentality. I'm you know,I'm like completely transparent with with my experiences
that I used to have the victimmentality. Like you know, I had
a rough childhood. You know,I lost both my parents. You know
this, and that happened to meand I just felt that it gave me,
it took my power away. Yeah, took it away, because I
felt that it validated why I shouldcontinue on this journey being a miserable person.
Yeah, and I just one daythought, like you know, I
can't, I have to, Ihave to, I have to create the
light that I want, you know, and it that just means peace,
is that means being able to offerother people grace and their experience to be
able to better understand humans and ourdelicate nature. You know, I just
I just one day I just decidedI don't want to be a victim anymore.
I just want to be part ofthe solution. I love that chance
to you for that. I wantto hear. So a couple things I
wanted to ask you. What islet's talk a little bit about concede creative
with that. Okay, yes,absolutely, Yes, a lot. What
is that about? I know itit's about, but please tell the audience
what that's about, because such likea magnificently beautiful thing and can I love
to hear more about that. Thankyou so about for going on. Five
years ago I had a traumatic incidenthappened where a doctor didn't deliver my daughter
on time and she developed because ofher hypoxic injuries, she developed cerebral pause.
So I wasn't able to go backto my corporate job at hand a
moder America. So this was thestart of me taking back my power.
So I decided that no, I'mnot going to lay down and die,
you know, I'm going to dealwith this situation. I'm going to be
the best mother I can to herand also still find something for me to
do that brings me happiness and enjoyso that's how that came about. I
got the opportunity to rent the spaceand honestly, it was nothing that was
like, you know, someone hasa dream to have a coffee shop and
they've planned it out for five yearsand they finally executed it. Wasn't a
situation like that at all. Itjust the you know, I kind of
brought up the idea and the personthat I brought the idea up to own
buildings and said, well, Ihave this space. It was. It
was pretty much a rundown spot,like it was corkboard in the window.
It was just completely like it hadbeen, you know, for closed down
for quite a while. Uh Huh. So, you know, as I
do with a lot of things,I saw the potential in it and I
said to myself, I'm not ready, but will I ever be? And
I said the worst that can happenout of it is I learn, I
grow, you know, and it'sbeen a total growth experience. I've never
ran a business before, you know, I've never had to deal with people
on that type of level, notjust a you know, coworker job kind
of situation, and so the cottonz creative was borne out of my love
for creativity, for art, forothers to be able to express themselves and
also have an, you know,a little small area where they can test
that, you know, put theirbig toe on the water and test it
out and test their ideas out,test their products out and, you know,
things that they've made at home and, you know, some of their
dreams. And so far it's beenit's been a really great experience. Five
months after we open covid we hadthe riots and then we had covid so
we've been kind of writing the stormout with it, you know, just
still holding on and holding on tothe fact that we enjoy what we do
and we joy we enjoy offering whatwe do to the community. So throughout
this experience, like it's been ahuge part of my healing is having the
space. So we have vendors that, you know, make all kinds of
things, from skin cares to candlesto jewelry, to school teachers at write
books, just a lot of creativepeople from all different kinds of backgrounds and
we just all come together to basicallyshowcase what we do to the world and
also we expand a little bit onit by, you know, offering things
for the community. You know,it's become so much more than a shop
for me and that's part of thereason why I've held on to it because,
you know, I have people thatwalk in just to talk. Yeah,
just to talk, just to havesomeone to talk to, to sit
there and say I'm having bad day, I'm having a good day, you
know, just for God to giveme the opportunity to help other people heal.
It's been great that. I lovethat sense of community. I love
that you understand that creatives need community, you know. And yes, it's
about having a space to do thething that you do or and or a
space to showcase what you've done,and it's also having people who are like
minded have the opportunity to to toconnect with each other. You know,
that's so especially through some of thethings that we have at that happen to
us in life. You know,her hub, her hub, is very
similar to that, and that's oneof the things that I always find so
exciting about what you're doing is thatHara have is similar and it's more about
entrepreneurs, you know, creative andotherwise. But ultimately it really people crave
community. Oh yeah, he'll cravesupport for their dreams and I think that,
as much as the world talks aboutbeing unique and individual and all of
that, once you get into theworld of living your dreams, whether they're
creative or not, you run intosome resistance and it's really helpful to have
a tribe around you. That understandthat and that can have your back when
it's not necessarily about the soap orthe lotion or the piece of artwork or
the the next client, but it'smore about just the fatigue or the frustration
or the fear, you know,or just meeting some encouragement. So I
love it. That's what you're upto, absolutely just coexisting together with,
you know, the mind frame ofwe're all humans on this journey and we're
all just trying to be happy andfind things that we love to do and
also get that support from other people. So that's been a great experience.
I looked on your website and Isaw this this quote that I don't know
if it's your quote or where itcame from, but it resonated with me
and I'm actually going to stick iton post it and it is created.
Creativity is just intelligence having fount.Is that your quote or where that I
actually think that was. I don'twant to say and I think it might
be Albert Einstein. Okay, Ithink guys, I loved that quote.
I don't I don't think I've neverheard it before. I don't think,
not that I remember, and butI went on to your website just kind
of check out those going on.I saw that. It really resonated with
me because it's the truth. Itis you know, it is. Yeah,
I think we're all. I I'vealways had this mindframe of thinking that
everyone, like God, made nomistakes, everyone has some form of intelligence,
and I think with creatives they're justable to tap in a certain part
of their brain or just a certainspiritual part of themselves that maybe others cannot,
and it is a really high formof intelligence and as the way it's
expressed. You just look around andthe artwork and in the creations and the
innovation and its all, you know, creative creativity surrounds all of you know,
these things, these ideas and thesebeautiful things that we see come about,
and I think that's something that alot of people don't think about,
is like, you know, wesee this beautiful structure or we see this
beautiful piece of art, but wedon't think about like, yeah, you
know, some people say, Oh, that's beautiful, but they don't really
think like that is just where thatcomes from within that person. Yeah,
that kind and how much that meansto them, you know, and that's
and that's why, with the artistthat I work with in a shop.
Like they all have, you know, different types of art, you know,
they they have different styles and everything, but I just really see their
passions and and how much they sayit brings some peace and how they have
to paint, they have to dothese things because it's just part of who
they are. Yeah, and Ithink it's like you have to dig deep,
you know. It's there's like anexpansion of who you are that is
reflected in the art that you create, in the art that you do.
It it's a reflection of the abilityto dig deep and absolute and we all
have that ability in different ways.We all have different gifts and talents and
all of that. And whoever theperson is and whatever it is that they're
creating, that's that they've actually putsome thought into, is just the reflection
of an expansion of what you have, you know, which is a beautiful
thing. You know, it's incrediblewhat we can do when we get out
of, you know, the ratrace of, you know, just going
through the steps and doing all thethings, but when you take a moment
to really own your life and makethose, you know, creative and curatorial
decisions about your life. Yes,it's incredible what you can do with that.
Absolutely, and that's why I've grownsuch a huge appreciation for the things
that people do, because it comesfrom, you know, we just,
like I said, we just seethe physical thing, but the where it
comes from. It just comes from, you know, their experiences, their
childhood, how they feel everything.I mean, products are brought to market
based on needs and things and it'sother experiences that people have had, you
know. So it's just, youknow, an appreciation for it is.
I've, you know, just growna deeper appreciation for the things that people
do. I can see your generosityin the way that you share and in
the way that you show up inthe world. You know, even when
it's like a funky day for you, you express it with incredible generosity,
which I think is really appreciated bythe folks that, you know that have
you on their on their feed.You know, this has the that have
you as one of their, youknow, boxes on their feet. It's
part of your brand. You know. I appreciate that. Thank you so
much. I appreciate it, Ireally do, because, trust me,
there are some folks I'm like,Nip, Oh, yeah, I can't
have you in my brain every day, you're just say I can't do it.
You know, no judgment, justnot for me. Right. Okay,
so I have a couple of questionsfor you. All Right, so
you've gone through a couple of challengingsituations that you mentioned briefly. What we
all have a different story or differentdishes that we've been in for different reasons.
Right. What could you share abouthow to come through a challenging situation
in your life, in a person'slife? I would say, just given
my particular situations and Traumas that I'vebeen through since I was a child,
I just think that I feel thatno matter what happens in life, that
we still have a responsibility and thatresponsibility is to put out the best that
we can to help other people getthrough it. So, you know,
if you've gone through something traumatic oryou've had, you know, childhood trauma
or you've had, like you know, just terrible experiences and losses and and
things like that, it can takeyou to a really, really dark place
and you just you you are responsiblefor pulling yourself out of those dark places.
It's you know, I don't putthat responsibility on anyone else but myself
because no matter what anyone tells me. It's up to me. It's up
to me to make the best outof the life that I was given,
because there was so many things.There's there are so many things that are
outside of our control, so manythings that we wish didn't happen, so
many things that we wish we canchange, but we can't. So the
best way to deal with those thingsis to first of all recognize that they
happen and then also do your bestto heal him and whatever healing is for
you. You know, everyone hasto create their own way to heal.
You know, for some people theymeditate, for some people they pray,
for some people they paint, youknow, whatever it is, you just
have to despite whatever happened that youdidn't have control over. You just have
to dig deep within yourself, pullyourself out of those dark places and just
find different ways that you can healand you'll know while you're on that healing
journey. You'll know what's working what'snot working, because throughout the healing process
you'll try different things and they mayor may not work, you know,
but it's just continually continuing to workon your healing process. That is what
I recommend to anyone that's been throughdark times or have been through situations where,
you know, it pretty much broughtthem to their knees or you know,
it just brought them to a placewhere they thought that they couldn't come
out of. But you can't comeout of those places. You can't.
It can be absolutely hard to butit's never impossible. You most certainly can.
You just had to recognize what theissue is, recognize your feelings.
You know, that's the thing.Is like sometimes, you know, we
have all these, you know,feelings harboring within us and we don't recognize
them, and that's the first thing, that's the first thing you have to
do in order to heal. Youknow, like myself, like my mother
died from cancer. You know,my father died from a cocaine induce heart
attack when I was nineteen, andI had to see both my both of
those, I had to, youknow, witness both of my parents.
I had I seen both my parentstake their last breaths. So that's you
know, those are traumatic things thatyou can't change, you can't control,
and it's going to always be there. It's going to always still be there
somewhat. But I think that withtraumatic situations, with pain, with loss,
but disappointments is that don't let itbe a total loss for you,
you know, don't let someone's deathbe in vain. Don't let you know
a disappointment in there. Let somethinggood grow out of that and that that's
that's my thought on that. Yeah, I love that. Thank you for
sharing that. I you know,my mother passed away in two thousand eight
and I went to a friend notlong after and she asked me what,
what was the the thread of mymother's life like? What was the thing?
And we talked about what that thingwas and her suggestion to me,
which was really wise, was takethat and move it forward. So if
there was something in your mother's lifethat held back not only her but held
back a piece of your familial legacy, because you know I'm all about that,
right, then look at what thatis and see what you can do
to move that one thing forward.And I found and in that moment I
was grieving. It was not longafter my mother passed away and I couldn't
fully take that in or process it. And over time, though, I
began to recognize what that was.You know where the power was in that
to see, you know what,that thing what I could do to move
that part of our family legacy forward, and I did and it was it
was really helpful, you know.So when my father passed away five years
later, I had that I stillhad that nugget and and it helped and
it helped with my process. That'samazing. Yeah, I agree. You
know, I'm at a point inmy life where I feel that it's my
responsibility to break generational curses and generationalthings that have happened to my family.
My mission is not only to docertain things that are kind of all my
bucket list or on my dream list, but also live my life in a
manner where these bad things that happendon't continue and and these things that were
learned don't continue. You know,I just had a discussion recently about that,
about, you know, how Iwas raised and how, in the
beginning of Motherhood, I felt thatthose negative traits, you know that my
parents they probably didn't know because,you know, it was something passed down
to them, that I just feltI was continuing on that path and then
I realized no, that's not that'snot right. Just because that's what my
grandma did, that's what my daddid, that's what my mom did.
That does not mean it's right.So part of my mission is to you
know, at the end of mylife, for me to look up and
say I created a different pattern formy future generations. Yeah, yeah,
Bravo to you for that. Youknow, me too. Me Too.
I think it's really easy to whowe get to a certain point in life
where we have these moments in life, these crossroad moments in life, where
we know darn well that we cango on autopilot and continue bs or represented
with an opportunity to do things alittle bit differently. And, you know,
Bravo to the ways that you've chosento do things differently. Thank you.
Thank you, you know, andI'm going to acknowledge myself for having
done the same in some instances whereit's easy to be like, well,
I'm going to rage too, becauseyou know, because there's a million reasons
why you can do certain things,or you take that stop, like you
said, that moment to say,Hmm, I know that I can do
this because I know how to dothis. For me it was I knew
how to be angry right, butthen I started to recognize that buying into
that is really an investment into.It's a bad investment. Oh, yes,
right, it's a bad investment that'sgoing to keep rolling and rolling and
it can only take away, it'snot going to add. And so,
for certain areas in my life Ihave a lot to be grateful for in
terms of my family and the thingsI got from my parents and from my
family and from my my ancestors.I got some great stuff and and I
also know that there are some thingsthat I'm responsible for changing, and so
I'm actively trying to do that.Awesome. That's awesome. I definitely understand.
It's just and I think honestly,with covid happening, it was kind
of a blessing and a curse atthe same time, because I realized talk
to says, yeah, I feellike there was a lot of gross that
happened too, a lot of gross. I mean, I think I really
allowed us to really sit down andthink and analyze and and really see which
way we want our life to goand which way we want our story to
be told. You know, youknow, my big thing is, you
know, the way certain things happenin my family. Like I didn't want
that to be my narrative. Idon't want that to be my narrative anymore.
I just, you know, likeyou said, I was an angry
person, like I was quick tojust get angry or or handle to certain
situations the wrong way. But now, you know, I'm choosing to just
change everything, just change my path, you know, just just go on
a whole new path. Good foryou. Lead on. How can we
all help you, Hal when wesupport you? You know, honestly,
that's trying to think. I'm it'skind of a difficult question, but I
would just say, I mean whereyour question came from, but that's your
supporting me now, like this isthis is awesome, like, I've never
been on a podcast before, littlelong your podcast, so this is really
a blessing. So I feel verysupported in this moment. I feel blessed
to it. How can we supportYour Business? How can we support you,
even if it's just what can wedo, like, what do you
need right now? I would justsay visit our website, wwwcon CDXCOM,
and then follow us on social media. I do have plans on doing some
other things. I'm trying to growand what I'm doing starting a retail store,
was just kind of like something onmy bucket list, something that helped
me grow, something that filled mycup, and I'm just looking to do
other things now. I'm looking tojust try to, you know, achieve
all the things that I've I've beentrying to do, but also keep,
keep people at the forefront of everything. That's that's kind of what I want,
I want my focus to be,because I see a lot of you
know, like I know, peoplethat are have done successful things, but
they've lost touch with humanity and Ithink it's easy to happen and I've put
myself in their shoes and I say, well, I see how that can
happen, but I just want tomake sure that, no matter where I
go on this journey is that Ikeep people first. Wow, that's powerful.
Thank you for the way that you'reshowing up in this world. I
really appreciate it. Thank I appreciateyou as well. Thank you for showing
up here with me and having thisconversation with me. I really absolutely,
absolutely, I come back. Definitely, if I'm invited, I'll be here.
Okay, yeah, thank you somuch. You're welcome. Thank you
so much for listening to my conversationwith you. Va Michelle. I got
so much out of speaking with herand hearing from her. This woman has
incredible strength and grace and I reallyappreciated her taking the time to chat with
me and to share with all ofyou. I hope that you got something
out of it and that you tooksome notes, and there are some things
for me that really stuck out,like the fact that humans are delicate,
we really really are, and someof the practices that she shared about how
she ensures that her day is theday that she really wants to have.
I got a lot out of thisand I hope that you did too.
Thank you so much also for listeningto the shaping freedom podcast. I really
appreciate it and look forward to sharingmy next guest with you soon.